7:10pm Eastern
RED SOX
Rick Porcello (R)
1. Mookie Betts (R) RF
2. Rafael Devers (L) 3B
3. Xander Bogaerts (R) SS
4. J.D. Martinez (R) DH
5. Andrew Benintendi (L) LF
6. Michael Chavis (R) 1B
7. Jackie Bradley Jr. (L) CF
8. Sandy Leon (S) C
9. Brock Holt (L) 2B
BLUE JAYS
Trent Thornton (R)
1. Eric Sogard (L) DH
2. Freddy Galvis (S) SS
3. Lourdes Gurriel Jr. (R) LF
4. Cavan Biggio (L) 2B
5. Randal Grichuk (R) CF
6. Justin Smoak (S) 1B
7. Danny Jansen (R) C
8. Billy McKinney (L) RF
9. Brandon Drury (R) 3B
Gametime Temp: 82°F
Chance of Precip: 0%
As DAD would say, "SON, LIKE SAND THRU THE HOUR GLASS, SO ARE THE DAYS OF OUR RED SOX" !!!!! SOX need to go on a RUN starting NOW GRASSHOPPER !!!!! Shake up that ROSTER !!! iono iono iono
Red Sox Notes
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1h1 hour ago
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Xander Bogaerts and Mike Trout are the only AL players batting .300+ with 20+ HR.
Bogaerts leads the Sox in HR (20), RBI (71), and OPS (.948).
According to FanGraphs, Bogaerts ranks 4th among position players in WAR (4.1) behind Trout (6.5), Bellinger (5.7), and Yelich (5.2).
Porcello????? The guy has been a human pinata all season giving up tons of hits and runs. No way the Red Sox can be that stupid to resign this guy to a new contract. After this season they need to send his ass out of town without looking back. Tonight? Don't expect much from this bum unless the Red Sox go out there and put nine runs on the board, although after last night's total choke-up performance the team must be traumatized as they've been all year when facing a good team........Tonight the Torontoans might look like a powerhouse against our choking dogs.
Quote from: Murph on July 15, 2019, 12:54:24 PM
Red Sox Notes
@SoxNotes
1h1 hour ago
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Xander Bogaerts and Mike Trout are the only AL players batting .300+ with 20+ HR.
Bogaerts leads the Sox in HR (20), RBI (71), and OPS (.948).
According to FanGraphs, Bogaerts ranks 4th among position players in WAR (4.1) behind Trout (6.5), Bellinger (5.7), and Yelich (5.2).
And yet in the ninth inning with two on and two out he did what he almost always does in these situations.....HE STRUCK OUT!!!------JUST AS i SAID HE WOULD WHEN HE CAME TO THE PLATE.. He is having a good season, avery good season and contributes on most occasions but almost never in the type of occasion we saw last night. Then, again, the loss wasn't his fault. The pitching was good between the book ends but David was not sharp and /Cora's favorite Velasquez, who should be sent out of town yesterday, did what he has done al season-----stink up the joint. Today I am as pissed off as I have even been this season. Losing to the Dodgers just eats me up alive.
Porcello certainly isn't worth the big bucks he gets. He can throw some great games and then he can give up 5 runs in a hurry too. But listening to the stats last night, he's really not the problem, nor is Betts. It's Sale and the 5th rotation spot. We have 5 wins between the 1st and 5th rotation spots. We have numerous games given up by the bullpen. This just magnifies other errors because there is no room for those errors. If they simply had 5 more wins out of those two slots and 3 out of the pen, this season would be completely different. We all know why - from Spring Training to not filling out a full staff given Eovaldi's past (he must have set a record for money earned in a 7 inning losing relief appearance!) to letting two good arms go and not replace them.
So you can't fix those things, but you can address them going forward and Cashner was part of it, but they need at least two more reliable arms in that bullpen. Also, when all of your problems are pitching, doesn't some blame have to go on the pitching coach? Why hasn't this guy been run out of town yet?
Quote from: SeaBeachFred on July 15, 2019, 01:02:46 PM
Quote from: Murph on July 15, 2019, 12:54:24 PM
Red Sox Notes
@SoxNotes
1h1 hour ago
More
Xander Bogaerts and Mike Trout are the only AL players batting .300+ with 20+ HR.
Bogaerts leads the Sox in HR (20), RBI (71), and OPS (.948).
According to FanGraphs, Bogaerts ranks 4th among position players in WAR (4.1) behind Trout (6.5), Bellinger (5.7), and Yelich (5.2).
And yet in the ninth inning with two on and two out he did what he almost always does in these situations.....HE STRUCK OUT!!!------JUST AS i SAID HE WOULD WHEN HE CAME TO THE PLATE.. He is having a good season, avery good season and contributes on most occasions but almost never in the type of occasion we saw last night. Then, again, the loss wasn't his fault. The pitching was good between the book ends but David was not sharp and /Cora's favorite Velasquez, who should be sent out of town yesterday, did what he has done al season-----stink up the joint. Today I am as pissed off as I have even been this season. Losing to the Dodgers just eats me up alive.
3 -5 with 2 runs scored, an RBI and a HR. He can't do it all Fred. JD Martinez left a few on there behind Bogey too.
Quote from: longgame on July 15, 2019, 01:05:41 PM
Quote from: SeaBeachFred on July 15, 2019, 01:02:46 PM
Quote from: Murph on July 15, 2019, 12:54:24 PM
Red Sox Notes
@SoxNotes
1h1 hour ago
More
Xander Bogaerts and Mike Trout are the only AL players batting .300+ with 20+ HR.
Bogaerts leads the Sox in HR (20), RBI (71), and OPS (.948).
According to FanGraphs, Bogaerts ranks 4th among position players in WAR (4.1) behind Trout (6.5), Bellinger (5.7), and Yelich (5.2).
And yet in the ninth inning with two on and two out he did what he almost always does in these situations.....HE STRUCK OUT!!!------JUST AS i SAID HE WOULD WHEN HE CAME TO THE PLATE.. He is having a good season, avery good season and contributes on most occasions but almost never in the type of occasion we saw last night. Then, again, the loss wasn't his fault. The pitching was good between the book ends but David was not sharp and /Cora's favorite Velasquez, who should be sent out of town yesterday, did what he has done al season-----stink up the joint. Today I am as pissed off as I have even been this season. Losing to the Dodgers just eats me up alive.
3 -5 with 2 runs scored, an RBI and a HR. He can't do it all Fred. JD Martinez left a few on there behind Bogey too.
Oh I know that too Ted. I was just making a point that in that kind of situation XB has always been deficient in that regard. Certainly he is less culpable than so many others in the lineup for that horseshit performance of the team last night. I hate it like hell to lose to the Dodgers.
I'm hoping they put on a more entertaining show, although the late innings had some excitement last night. But baseball is tiresome when every at bat is a walk, an error, a HR or a K.
You bring up a good point, I have become concerned that there is too much emphasis on the strike out. Pitchers are forgetting how to pitch to contact. Purcello was a better pitcher when he was a sinker baller who induced ground outs.
I wonder how much Lavangie's lack of actual pitching experience has contributed to the clubs current pitching woes or is he merely another symptom of this organization's total lack of success at pitcher development.
Quote from: elktonnick on July 15, 2019, 05:37:06 PM
You bring up a good point, I have become concerned that there is too much emphasis on the strike out. Pitchers are forgetting how to pitch to contact. Purcello was a better pitcher when he was a sinker baller who induced ground outs.
I wonder how much Lavangie's lack of actual pitching experience has contributed to the clubs current pitching woes or is he merely another symptom of this organization's total lack of success at pitcher development.
Probably both. Pitcher development has suffered for a while but Lavangie seems to be affecting the veterans.
The Jays may wear blue, but they are no Dodgers. 5-0 Sox in the first on the Chavis Grand Slam!
The Jays are showing some fight and made it 5-4 now in the third. What has happened to Rick?
Porcello is getting clobbered. The effective Porcello pitched down in the zone. This version is up constantly. I don't understand why they aren't working with him on this. No one on the NESN broadcast is mentioning this but I recall this was the common commentary years past that is to be effective Rick Porcello had to pitch down in the zone. Why the change?
Why is Manager Neuman letting Braiser continue to pitch.
More sloppy baseball but Manager What Me Worry finally pulls Braiser.
But he puts in Barnes.
No lead is safe with the cast of characters in the Pen.
Workman with a clean 9th for the save.
Quote from: elktonnick on July 15, 2019, 07:23:53 PM
Porcello is getting clobbered. The effective Porcello pitched down in the zone. This version is up constantly. I don't understand why they aren't working with him on this. No one on the NESN broadcast is mentioning this but I recall this was the common commentary years past that is to be effective Rick Porcello had to pitch down in the zone. Why the change?
Porcello needs help and tutoring in the worst way. Perhaps he should drop that four seamer that stays high and is very hittable as shownby the way Rick has been getting the shit knocked out of him...like again tonight and having Levangie as pitching coach does nothing because I'm convinced the guy doesn't know shit from shinola about pitching. Both need to go, but I would think if Porcello gets with a good pitching coach next season he will pitch better. Cora wanted Levangie last year as hit pitching tutor so that should tell you all you need to know.
Quote from: Sea Dog 23 on July 15, 2019, 09:40:47 PM
Workman with a clean 9th for the save.
Anybody out there feel confident when our bullpen is called on to save a lead? I'm not, and I think Dombrowski needs to address that fast. We get ten runs and it is still a nail biter. Tonight's win doesn't please me one twit because once again the pen shit the bed, this time Brasier who for the most part has been horse dung since the second week of the season.
Quote from: SeaBeachFred on July 15, 2019, 10:22:48 PM
Quote from: Sea Dog 23 on July 15, 2019, 09:40:47 PM
Workman with a clean 9th for the save.
Anybody out there feel confident when our bullpen is called on to save a lead? I'm not, and I think Dombrowski needs to address that fast. We get ten runs and it is still a nail biter. Tonight's win doesn't please me one twit because once again the pen shit the bed, this time Brasier who for the most part has been horse dung since the second week of the season.
Fred, I think we've tied our wagon to horses that are going to break the hearts of Sox fans around the country.
I saw that the Rays got a go-ahead 3run homer in the 9th at Yankee Stadium. Again st their BP that sends a message to the AL. We play the contenders a lot coming up, I think NY and Rays 9 times in the next 20. With the contenders now going after good pitching at the deadline (Nyy dealing with Mets?) , I think we're in deep sh!t. We are just screwed by our rotation this year. We really need about three Eovaldis.
One game at a time …… YANKS & RAYS in a big 4 game series !!!!! SOX, take care of business !!!! thumb_u thumb_u
The bullpen tried to give this away.
Elk - Porcello's pitching location was the talk of a lot of discussion earlier in the year. I think Lavangie is enamored with the high fastball as a lot of hitters are looking up there to launch one but can't catch up with the high ones. The problem is if you leave it down it gets cleaned out. Like you mentioned yesterday, I don't think pitching low is in favor anymore unless it's a breaking ball in the dirt. The other thing was Porcello wasn't getting calls in the bottom of the strike zone last night.
Fred - no I'm not comfortable with any of these guys and these guys aren't comfortable because they don't have roles. This is bullpen management 101 and we saw what a disaster it was the last time the Sox used bullpen by committee. This is a proven failed strategy and that's why it doesn't work.
Sea Dog - you are right. We need 3 good arms and they are a brokedown horse.
Quote from: longgame on July 16, 2019, 08:06:49 AM
The bullpen tried to give this away.
Elk - Porcello's pitching location was the talk of a lot of discussion earlier in the year. I think Lavangie is enamored with the high fastball as a lot of hitters are looking up there to launch one but can't catch up with the high ones. The problem is if you leave it down it gets cleaned out. Like you mentioned yesterday, I don't think pitching low is in favor anymore unless it's a breaking ball in the dirt. The other thing was Porcello wasn't getting calls in the bottom of the strike zone last night.
Fred - no I'm not comfortable with any of these guys and these guys aren't comfortable because they don't have roles. This is bullpen management 101 and we saw what a disaster it was the last time the Sox used bullpen by committee. This is a proven failed strategy and that's why it doesn't work.
Sea Dog - you are right. We need 3 good arms and they are a brokedown horse.
Low and away is always an effective pitch The problem Porcello is having is he is pitching to the center of the plate.
But nobody is pitching like that anymore, at least on the Sox. Or when they do, it's really away. It seems that the shift has lead to the HR boom, which has led to the hot arm boom, which as led to more high fastballs with the thought that a guy swinging hard will never get his bat up that high (maybe they never saw Gary Sheffield!). Maybe they ought to get back to the basics that have worked for the past 100 years - throw it by the guy, not around him.
Quote from: longgame on July 16, 2019, 10:11:44 AM
But nobody is pitching like that anymore, at least on the Sox. Or when they do, it's really away. It seems that the shift has lead to the HR boom, which has led to the hot arm boom, which as led to more high fastballs with the thought that a guy swinging hard will never get his bat up that high (maybe they never saw Gary Sheffield!). Maybe they ought to get back to the basics that have worked for the past 100 years - throw it by the guy, not around him.
The JUICED BALL is the major culprit ……..IMO ….. iono iono
Quote from: longgame on July 16, 2019, 10:11:44 AM
But nobody is pitching like that anymore, at least on the Sox. Or when they do, it's really away. It seems that the shift has lead to the HR boom, which has led to the hot arm boom, which as led to more high fastballs with the thought that a guy swinging hard will never get his bat up that high (maybe they never saw Gary Sheffield!). Maybe they ought to get back to the basics that have worked for the past 100 years - throw it by the guy, not around him.
That's where I am at
Quote from: Sea Dog 23 on July 16, 2019, 05:43:57 AM
Quote from: SeaBeachFred on July 15, 2019, 10:22:48 PM
Quote from: Sea Dog 23 on July 15, 2019, 09:40:47 PM
Workman with a clean 9th for the save.
Anybody out there feel confident when our bullpen is called on to save a lead? I'm not, and I think Dombrowski needs to address that fast. We get ten runs and it is still a nail biter. Tonight's win doesn't please me one twit because once again the pen shit the bed, this time Brasier who for the most part has been horse dung since the second week of the season.
Fred, I think we've tied our wagon to horses that are going to break the hearts of Sox fans around the country.
I saw that the Rays got a go-ahead 3run homer in the 9th at Yankee Stadium. Again st their BP that sends a message to the AL. We play the contenders a lot coming up, I think NY and Rays 9 times in the next 20. With the contenders now going after good pitching at the deadline (Nyy dealing with Mets?) , I think we're in deep sh!t. We are just screwed by our rotation this year. We really need about three Eovaldis.
Right now my friend I would settle for one healthy and effective Eovaldi. As for the rest of your missive I'm afraid you may be very very right Sea Dog.
Quote from: longgame on July 16, 2019, 08:06:49 AM
The bullpen tried to give this away.
Elk - Porcello's pitching location was the talk of a lot of discussion earlier in the year. I think Lavangie is enamored with the high fastball as a lot of hitters are looking up there to launch one but can't catch up with the high ones. The problem is if you leave it down it gets cleaned out. Like you mentioned yesterday, I don't think pitching low is in favor anymore unless it's a breaking ball in the dirt. The other thing was Porcello wasn't getting calls in the bottom of the strike zone last night.
Fred - no I'm not comfortable with any of these guys and these guys aren't comfortable because they don't have roles. This is bullpen management 101 and we saw what a disaster it was the last time the Sox used bullpen by committee. This is a proven failed strategy and that's why it doesn't work.
Sea Dog - you are right. We need 3 good arms and they are a brokedown horse.
Ted---what can you do??? You, Sea Dog, Elk and Bill see the same things I am seeing but why is Cora so tone deaf to what's happened to us this season? Porcello should go back to the two seemer and get more movement on the ball and get it to run more and keep it down. But it all comes down to how the pen was put together in the first place. Bullpen and Closer by committee is a design that has failure written all over it and it astounds me that so many teams (us in 2003 and 2019) and others seem to go to it every few years with disastrous results and yet never learn from those mistakes. Right now though I don't give a rat's ass for how it effects other teams, just how it is effecting our team. Again, I hark back to ST where this debacle was first put into effect. We've been reaping the whirlwind from Cora's mismanaging since.
They were talking in the pre-game about how Cashner likes to stay around the plate. I thought “The Sox will cure him of that!â€