Pitchers to watch this season?

[longgame]

I certainly wouldn't want Ohtani's contract paying him out $50MM a year.  Not sure how the Dodgers swing that either.  Economics may finally catch up with someone? (not likely lol).  I also think Yomamoto is a risk for that long of a contract at that level for never having thrown an inning in MLB.  For every Ohtani there are many DiceK's and Yoshidas.  Do you really want to break the bank on an unknown for a long period of time?   Of course the Mets aren't known for making good big money deals so maybe they'd do it and then trade him mid-year.

Those two guys will dominate the free agent talk and maybe there's a little wait and see yet on those guys, but it seems like a good opportunity to go after guys you really want and fit in your strategy.  Per some of the earlier posts, defense should be part of that strategy.  Let's put out a team that isn't embarrassing to watch.

[SeaBeachFred]

Can't disagree Ted but you might of mentioned just who you think we should be going after----or are you going back and forth like the rest of us and can't make up your mind either.  I now have to barf or get away from the sink so I will tell you what I think we should do.  I want Whit Merrifield for second base (also can play the outfield and hits RH).  I would go all out to sign Rhys Hoskins for DH, 1B and outfield duty.....another RH with power coming off an injury with the Phillies but still young enough to make a strong comeback.  Pitching?  Yes on Yamamoto, and then sign lefthander Montgomery.  Of course, that's a large number of players so some say, BUT IN BOLD CAPS WE NEED SOME TOUGH COMPETITORS WITH TALENT to get ourselves out of the hole we're in.  Well at least I have come clean.  How about you Ted and the rest of my pals on this board.  Let's see some of you make some tough decisions as to where we should go.  You have one big consolation.......NOT MATTER WHO YOU GUYS PICK YOU CAN'T DO ANY WORSE THAT BLOOM DID OR THOSE OTHER TURKEYS IN OUR FRONT OFFICE THAT HAVE MADE OUR CLUB AN EMBARASSMENT SO FAR THIS DECADE.

[Sea Dog 23]

The Red Sox went after pitcher Wyatt Mills in a round about way.  Two weeks ago he was non-tendered, but today they signed him to a minor league deal.  They must see a lot of value in Mills, as he underwent TJS in July and probably won't pitch in 2024.

Also the Sox attended a pitching season in the Dominican to watch 27 yr old Cuban Yuriel Rodriguez, who throws high velocity.  The Padres were the two teams to watch Rodriguez.

[MongoLikeSox]

The Red Sox went after pitcher Wyatt Mills in a round about way.  Two weeks ago he was non-tendered, but today they signed him to a minor league deal.  They must see a lot of value in Mills, as he underwent TJS in July and probably won't pitch in 2024.

Also the Sox attended a pitching season in the Dominican to watch 27 yr old Cuban Yuriel Rodriguez, who throws high velocity.  The Padres were the two teams to watch Rodriguez.

I was wondering if something like that might happen with Wyatt Mills. He's got a lot of rehab to do and is already under the 'Sox care. Sure, he dipped his toes in and probably found a cool reception. Good move. We'll make another decision on him in Nov 24.

[MongoLikeSox]

Can't disagree Ted but you might of mentioned just who you think we should be going after----or are you going back and forth like the rest of us and can't make up your mind either.  I now have to barf or get away from the sink so I will tell you what I think we should do.  I want Whit Merrifield for second base (also can play the outfield and hits RH).  I would go all out to sign Rhys Hoskins for DH, 1B and outfield duty.....another RH with power coming off an injury with the Phillies but still young enough to make a strong comeback.  Pitching?  Yes on Yamamoto, and then sign lefthander Montgomery.  Of course, that's a large number of players so some say, BUT IN BOLD CAPS WE NEED SOME TOUGH COMPETITORS WITH TALENT to get ourselves out of the hole we're in.  Well at least I have come clean.  How about you Ted and the rest of my pals on this board.  Let's see some of you make some tough decisions as to where we should go.  You have one big consolation.......NOT MATTER WHO YOU GUYS PICK YOU CAN'T DO ANY WORSE THAT BLOOM DID OR THOSE OTHER TURKEYS IN OUR FRONT OFFICE THAT HAVE MADE OUR CLUB AN EMBARASSMENT SO FAR THIS DECADE.

I'm with you on both Merrifield and Montgomery. I would not be upset about Yamamoto, either. I think he's too hot a commodity to be affordable, though.

No to Snell. Maybe no to Sonny Gray. He did not do well under the NY big market lights.

The Cardinals pulled two Bloom deals last week, signing Kyle Gibson and Lance Lynn. I'm SOOOO glad we don't have that going on, I think.

There is a trio of pitchers available that are probably going to be 22-25 start guys here on out. Two of them we are already familiar with in Michael Wacha and James Paxton. Wacha's been two straight nice seasons and we've seen what Paxton can do before nursing his knee late in the season. Marcus Stroman is the 3rd. He's started 27, 25 and 33 games the past three years. If we can't get Montgomery and/or Yamamoto, I could easily jump on the any number of these three for next season. I'm also OK with E-Rod.

[Sea Dog 23]

Rob Bradford is saying the Sox are in talks this week to trade for ChiSox Dylan Cease and OF/DH Eloy Jiminez.  It will hurt some, but not too damaging.  Duran, Yorke and P Luis Perales.

"The Red Sox need no-doubt-about-it top of the rotation starters. At least one, anyway. That's why Dylan Cease's name has come up," Brad ford said Cease, it would seem, is available in a trade from the White Sox for the right price. The problem for teams drooling over the 27-year-old is that price figures to be fairly steep. While Cease's numbers in 2023 took a turn for the worse (4.58 ERA in 32 starts) after finishing second in the American League Cy Young Award balloting, there were enough signs that the righty is a pitcher a rotation can be built around.

Jiminez as a rookie, his line .274 /.331/.453/.784   19 HR 68 RBI., bats RH, 27 yo.

[MongoLikeSox]

Rob Bradford is saying the Sox are in talks this week to trade for ChiSox Dylan Cease and OF/DH Eloy Jiminez.  It will hurt some, but not too damaging.  Duran, Yorke and P Luis Perales.

"The Red Sox need no-doubt-about-it top of the rotation starters. At least one, anyway. That's why Dylan Cease's name has come up," Brad ford said Cease, it would seem, is available in a trade from the White Sox for the right price. The problem for teams drooling over the 27-year-old is that price figures to be fairly steep. While Cease's numbers in 2023 took a turn for the worse (4.58 ERA in 32 starts) after finishing second in the American League Cy Young Award balloting, there were enough signs that the righty is a pitcher a rotation can be built around.

Jiminez as a rookie, his line .274 /.331/.453/.784   19 HR 68 RBI., bats RH, 27 yo.

I hate this. I hope it does not happen.
I do not view Dylan Cease as a "no-doubt-about-it" starter. Cease took too far of a slide last year. He was still hitable even in his good months. His two years before that had 3.91 and 4.0x ERAs. To me, he had a flash in the pan season. His velo dropped a tick, too.
Eloy Jiminez has been around a few years. Hit 31 HRs as a rookie in 2019. He's owed $48.8M over the next 3 years, but does have a pair of $3M buyouts for 2025 and 2026. No idea how he is on defense, but he's 0 for 0 in SB over 430+ games. 

So, IF Dylan Cease is a legit front line pitcher and we got him for 2 years, sure. Go for it. But I'm not seeing it.

[SeaBeachFred]

Rob Bradford is saying the Sox are in talks this week to trade for ChiSox Dylan Cease and OF/DH Eloy Jiminez.  It will hurt some, but not too damaging.  Duran, Yorke and P Luis Perales.

"The Red Sox need no-doubt-about-it top of the rotation starters. At least one, anyway. That's why Dylan Cease's name has come up," Brad ford said Cease, it would seem, is available in a trade from the White Sox for the right price. The problem for teams drooling over the 27-year-old is that price figures to be fairly steep. While Cease's numbers in 2023 took a turn for the worse (4.58 ERA in 32 starts) after finishing second in the American League Cy Young Award balloting, there were enough signs that the righty is a pitcher a rotation can be built around.

Jiminez as a rookie, his line .274 /.331/.453/.784   19 HR 68 RBI., bats RH, 27 yo.

I hate this. I hope it does not happen.
I do not view Dylan Cease as a "no-doubt-about-it" starter. Cease took too far of a slide last year. He was still hitable even in his good months. His two years before that had 3.91 and 4.0x ERAs. To me, he had a flash in the pan season. His velo dropped a tick, too.
Eloy Jiminez has been around a few years. Hit 31 HRs as a rookie in 2019. He's owed $48.8M over the next 3 years, but does have a pair of $3M buyouts for 2025 and 2026. No idea how he is on defense, but he's 0 for 0 in SB over 430+ games. 

So, IF Dylan Cease is a legit front line pitcher and we got him for 2 years, sure. Go for it. But I'm not seeing it.

I hate it even more.  For God's sake do not trade Yorke unless we get a sure big winner on the mound.....even then no can do.  Yorke is a big part of our future and we must not trade him. Cease played for a loser the past two seasons and anyone with White Sox credentials is suspect to me.  The guy is hittable and as for Eloy, the arrow on him has been down for the past couple of years.  His near $50 million bill over he next three years could be used for better options.......and when will the damn Red Sox understand that you have to keep Duran.  After being jerked around by Cora he got his chance last year and is good for 50+ stolen bases on a team that need speed since base pilfering is not back in fashion.  He also showed he can hit if kept in the lineup, though he needs to improve against southpaws.  In conclusion I don't like anything about that potential trade.  It stinks like a sewer at high tide.

[Sea Dog 23]

Rob Bradford is saying the Sox are in talks this week to trade for ChiSox Dylan Cease and OF/DH Eloy Jiminez.  It will hurt some, but not too damaging.  Duran, Yorke and P Luis Perales.

"The Red Sox need no-doubt-about-it top of the rotation starters. At least one, anyway. That's why Dylan Cease's name has come up," Brad ford said Cease, it would seem, is available in a trade from the White Sox for the right price. The problem for teams drooling over the 27-year-old is that price figures to be fairly steep. While Cease's numbers in 2023 took a turn for the worse (4.58 ERA in 32 starts) after finishing second in the American League Cy Young Award balloting, there were enough signs that the righty is a pitcher a rotation can be built around.

Jiminez as a rookie, his line .274 /.331/.453/.784   19 HR 68 RBI., bats RH, 27 yo.

I hate this. I hope it does not happen.
I do not view Dylan Cease as a "no-doubt-about-it" starter. Cease took too far of a slide last year. He was still hitable even in his good months. His two years before that had 3.91 and 4.0x ERAs. To me, he had a flash in the pan season. His velo dropped a tick, too.
Eloy Jiminez has been around a few years. Hit 31 HRs as a rookie in 2019. He's owed $48.8M over the next 3 years, but does have a pair of $3M buyouts for 2025 and 2026. No idea how he is on defense, but he's 0 for 0 in SB over 430+ games. 

So, IF Dylan Cease is a legit front line pitcher and we got him for 2 years, sure. Go for it. But I'm not seeing it.

Mongo, I think there is value in the Cease deal,  >IF<  you look at the competition for him.  Dodgers and Braves are also in the Cease talks this week, and they probably know pitching better than most pitching scouts in their league.  As far as the Sox, I don't think anybody can rank their rating system yet, as they're just getting started with several new guys at the top, but their scouting should have a good book on chicagoSox.  Maybe they all see that he is fixable and a return of Cease in 2022 when he was second in the Cy Young that year 14-8 and 2.2 era.  Now if they can sub Miedroth for Yorke in the trade hit, that may look like a better swap.
I saw some day/night splits on Cease which are telling
Cease daytime: 3.73 ERA, 1.29 WHIP
Cease night: 5.31 ERA, 1.53 WHIP

Baseball Trade Values indicate the White Sox would  approve the trade to include
Yorke
Schreiber
Perales
Valdez
Drohan

A caveat, he is a Boras client, so extending him after year three could be painful.

[Sea Dog 23]

This is out there as far as pitchers who have registered interest in Boston, or not
Yamamoto - waiting to set up a Zoom call. 
Montgomery - expressed interest per McAdams; living in Boston and his wife doing a medical residency not far from Fenway Park per Cotillo
Snell - expressed interest per McAdams

Probably not -
E-rod - Robert Murray today speculated a reunion was unlikely; Cotillo has suggested previously they did not make much of an effort to bring him back the last time around…

On the table -
Dylan Cease (trade) - per McAdams

No feedback -
Inamaga, Stroman, Giolito, Paxton, Lugo, Montas, Wacha, Severino, Ryu, Lorenzen, Casey Fossum -

[MongoLikeSox]

Mongo, I think there is value in the Cease deal,  >IF<  you look at the competition for him.  Dodgers and Braves are also in the Cease talks this week, and they probably know pitching better than most pitching scouts in their league.  As far as the Sox, I don't think anybody can rank their rating system yet, as they're just getting started with several new guys at the top, but their scouting should have a good book on chicagoSox.  Maybe they all see that he is fixable and a return of Cease in 2022 when he was second in the Cy Young that year 14-8 and 2.2 era.  Now if they can sub Miedroth for Yorke in the trade hit, that may look like a better swap.
I saw some day/night splits on Cease which are telling
Cease daytime: 3.73 ERA, 1.29 WHIP
Cease night: 5.31 ERA, 1.53 WHIP
A caveat, he is a Boras client, so extending him after year three could be painful.

All good points. One thing I don't know is pitching mechanics and such. If the Dodgers and Braves are willing to give up big pieces, perhaps he is a better candidate for a bounce-back year than I fear.

The Day-Night splits look like the opposite of Bello's Summer last season.

I think Cora is the bigger problem with a possible ERod return than the Red Sox brass not trying to sign him after 2021. We all remember ERod's last Fenway moment as glorious until Cora showed him up for talking smack back to Correa. Tsk tsk.

If this trade happens, I hope they're right. As presented, this has a decent chance to have some bad effects on the team now and in future years without improving them all that much next year. Which Cease we get ultimately decides if it's worth the price. It kills Yoshida chances for AB's at DH(and us getting better OF defense). The money spent on Jiminez could be spent elsewhere. We'd be 2-3 years away without a strong 2-way 2B prospect being ready unless Meidroth rebounds and/or Bonaci gets out from under that domestic Restricted list thing he's on now. I have not even brought up Duran.

Some additional food for thought. Take away just one year and Dylan Cease is in the low 30's QS% percentage. His Quality Start percentages were 21%, 33%, 31%, 50% and 36%. Inning depth was one of our biggest starting pitching problems last year. Inning depth into games. Bello (54%), Paxton (42%), Pivetta (31%), Sale(30%), Houck (24%) and Crawford(17%) are the incumbents SP. Pivetta and Sale each fell one start shy of Cease's 36% last year, which was his second best year to that end.

[longgame]

There are a lot of pitchers in the FA market and there's already some movement.  It looks like everyone is in on Yamamoto so that's a total wild card, so will teams want to jump before that deal sets a market or will agents want to wait for the same?  What's the Sox's plan if they don't get him?  Why give up a bunch of guys for Cease when you can get Snell or Montgomery for just money?  I saw enough of E-Rod and we all know the story - good stuff, doesn't keep his head in it. I don't see the Sox fixing that. There are also guys down the list, like Wacha, that wouldn't be a bad addition.

[Sea Dog 23]

There are a lot of pitchers in the FA market and there's already some movement.  It looks like everyone is in on Yamamoto so that's a total wild card, so will teams want to jump before that deal sets a market or will agents want to wait for the same?  What's the Sox's plan if they don't get him?  Why give up a bunch of guys for Cease when you can get Snell or Montgomery for just money?  I saw enough of E-Rod and we all know the story - good stuff, doesn't keep his head in it. I don't see the Sox fixing that. There are also guys down the list, like Wacha, that wouldn't be a bad addition.

It looks like the FA market has gone upside down.  It used to be they went for the money.  Now free-agents seem to be looking for incidentals along with the money.  Snell was quoted he wanted to stay on the West coast, near his home in Seattle.  Yamamotto wants a team with one of his home town Japan All-star boys.  Montgomery might like to stay near his wife, who now works in Boston.  Last year we lost out on Dansby Swanson, because his wife played on a team in Chicago. 

I'm concerned whether playing in Boston has become toxic, (because of Cora or the owners??).  We might end up over-paying for players, or worse settling on what's left near the bottom of the barrel.  Sure hope I'm wrong on all that.

[elktonnick]

There are a lot of pitchers in the FA market and there's already some movement.  It looks like everyone is in on Yamamoto so that's a total wild card, so will teams want to jump before that deal sets a market or will agents want to wait for the same?  What's the Sox's plan if they don't get him?  Why give up a bunch of guys for Cease when you can get Snell or Montgomery for just money?  I saw enough of E-Rod and we all know the story - good stuff, doesn't keep his head in it. I don't see the Sox fixing that. There are also guys down the list, like Wacha, that wouldn't be a bad addition.

It looks like the FA market has gone upside down.  It used to be they went for the money.  Now free-agents seem to be looking for incidentals along with the money.  Snell was quoted he wanted to stay on the West coast, near his home in Seattle.  Yamamotto wants a team with one of his home town Japan All-star boys.  Montgomery might like to stay near his wife, who now works in Boston.  Last year we lost out on Dansby Swanson, because his wife played on a team in Chicago. 

I'm concerned whether playing in Boston has become toxic, (because of Cora or the owners??).  We might end up over-paying for players, or worse settling on what's left near the bottom of the barrel.  Sure hope I'

m wrong on all that.

I think you raise a valid point.  I can not for the life of me think any pitcher would want to pitch for Cora.  Breslow has his work cut.

[SeaBeachFred]

There are a lot of pitchers in the FA market and there's already some movement.  It looks like everyone is in on Yamamoto so that's a total wild card, so will teams want to jump before that deal sets a market or will agents want to wait for the same?  What's the Sox's plan if they don't get him?  Why give up a bunch of guys for Cease when you can get Snell or Montgomery for just money?  I saw enough of E-Rod and we all know the story - good stuff, doesn't keep his head in it. I don't see the Sox fixing that. There are also guys down the list, like Wacha, that wouldn't be a bad addition.

It looks like the FA market has gone upside down.  It used to be they went for the money.  Now free-agents seem to be looking for incidentals along with the money.  Snell was quoted he wanted to stay on the West coast, near his home in Seattle.  Yamamotto wants a team with one of his home town Japan All-star boys.  Montgomery might like to stay near his wife, who now works in Boston.  Last year we lost out on Dansby Swanson, because his wife played on a team in Chicago. 

I'm concerned whether playing in Boston has become toxic, (because of Cora or the owners??).  We might end up over-paying for players, or worse settling on what's left near the bottom of the barrel.  Sure hope I'

m wrong on all that.

I think you raise a valid point.  I can not for the life of me think any pitcher would want to pitch for Cora.  Breslow has his work cut.

I'm beginning to smell a dumpster and a few of the morons running our organization are heading in that direction with knife and fork to sample the dredge of puke lying in there.